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Dec 9, 2011 4:42 PMPublication: The Southampton Press

Southampton Town Board Holds Off On Plastic Bag Ban

Dec 14, 2011 10:20 AM

The Southampton Town Board on Tuesday voted down a measure to hold a public hearing on legislation that would ban retailers townwide from distributing most plastic bags at checkout.

The main concern by the majority—Republicans Chris Nuzzi and Nancy Graboski and Conservative Jim Malone—was that they first wanted businesses to pitch in on an educational campaign that would try to broadcast the benefits of using reusable bags before the town became the third South Fork municipality to enact a ban on the use of plastic bags. They said it was something members of the board and representatives of the food industry agreed to do in June at a Town Board work session.

“I thought we had all agreed at that time [that] prior to coming forward with a public hearing on an actual ordinance, we were going to go ahead and test the public education idea with the support of the retail industry—who are directly impacted, obviously, as are consumers,” said Mr. Nuzzi.

But Councilwoman Bridget Fleming, a Democrat, and Independence Party member Supervisor Anna Throne-Holst both said statistics show that educational campaigns on reusable bags don’t yield significant results. They also said the town’s sensitive coastal environment and marine life are at risk—a prime motivator for the ban. Plastic bags are often found trapped in trees or littering waterways, and they can be harmful to marine animals that mistakenly eat them or get tangled in them.

Ms. Throne-Holst said based on her correspondence with representatives from the industry this year, they would be willing to fund an educational campaign only if it meant the town was not going to proceed with a plastic bag ban—terms she was unwilling to accept.

“I’m not going to make that promise to them,” Ms. Throne-Holst said. “I’m not going to say to them, ‘OK, industry, we’ll work with you on an education program, and we’ll never, ever put this ban in place.’ That’s what they’re asking us to do.”

But the majority board members contested the supervisor’s assertion. Based on an email addressed to the Town Board from Patricia Brodhagen, vice president of Public Affairs at the Food Industry Alliance of New York State, the grocery industry is committed to a “collaborative educational pilot program, including data collection so that results can be measured, as an alternative to legislation …” The email was provided by Ms. Graboski.

Ms. Throne-Holst said an educational campaign could be managed by the town six months before a ban would go into effect. During that time, the town’s energy and sustainability coordinator, Lizabeth Plouff, would work on the “nuts and bolts” of the program, including reaching out to retailers, handing out free reusable bags, and broadcasting messages through various media, including SEA-TV, the town’s government access channel.

Board members became ensnared in a lengthy argument about whether to go ahead and schedule a public hearing—often talking over each other—before they finally voted on the resolution.

Southampton Town is the third municipality on the East End to explore banning plastic bags. Southampton Village was the trendsetter, enacting a plastic bag ban in April that went into effect in November. East Hampton Village followed suit shortly after with a vote in July; its ban will go into effect in late January

Town officials have been mulling the initiative since early this summer. The proposed law mirrors Southampton Village’s legislation, mandating that retailers must provide reusable bags and/or recyclable paper bags at checkout. Those in violation of the law would face fines of $100 to $250. There was also a six-month grace period between when the ban is enacted and when it would go into effect.

The measure was the subject of a Town Board work session meeting on Friday afternoon. The chairman of the town’s Sustainable Southampton Green Advisory Committee, Tip Brolin, showed a short video outlining the environmental hazards of plastic bags. The video quoted a number of statistics, noting that the people in United States use 100 billion plastic bags per year, and that more than 100,000 marine animals each year die from discarded bags.

Thomas K. Cullen, vice president of government, industry and public relations for King Kullen Grocery Co. Inc., said his company opposed the proposed legislation. Paper costs more than plastic, he said, and he was worried about the “economic consequences of the bill.” The company owns three stores in Southampton Town.

Residents interviewed on Tuesday morning outside the Waldbaum’s supermarket in Southampton Village were mixed in their opinions on the village ban. Some said they absolutely hated it, while others said they had gotten used to it.

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Maybe the Town should mandate a real recycle program before plastic bags are banned. Fine all businesses that don't recycle plastic/cans/glass/paper. This includes all town buildings, schools, resturants and the hospital. All town garbage cans should accomodate the separation of plastic/cans/glass/paper. Our beach garbage is all co mingled. All garbage companies should be mandated to recycle. I have seen garbage trucks co mingle the recyclables with the garbage.
By auntof9 (159), Southampton on Dec 9, 11 5:56 PM
2 members liked this comment
Who's going to police that. The beauty of this program is that it doesn't cost the taxpayer anything. It's working (as proposed) in Westport, Teluride, SH Village and dozens of other places. Why is SH Town so s-p-e-c-i-a-l or are we so unable to change?
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 9, 11 9:45 PM
Really? Walbaums wanted to charge me .05 a bag. That doesn't cost me anything?
By diy_guy (101), Southampton on Dec 10, 11 6:59 AM
1 member liked this comment
Its that there is no recycling program like in most municipalities and that the brown paper bags, believe it or not, aren't much more green than the plastic bags. Its a feel good move by the colloquial leaders that want to leave some sort of, ahem, legacy. As if anyone remembers what they had to eat for lunch last week. And to top it off, those greedy souls that run the dilapidated Nusbaums don't feel that $7.00 is enough for a box of cereal, they have to now also charge you for the bags. You ...more
Dec 10, 11 7:50 AM appended by Brelane
Mr. Malone - its a reusable bag, stop putting us on. Never seen such focus from someone looking at something as common as a grocery bag.
By Brelane (16), Southampton on Dec 10, 11 7:50 AM
Listen, I'm about to tell you some "facts of life" on this one.

Politicans use recycling as a political "hot potato". As CDB said, "...and every politician wants a vote.". Sure, it started out hot after Cali made it hip in the eighties, but it fizzled a bit. As far as the pols, the reason that we don't have something comprehensive is what it can "cost". With the way modern recycling plants work, they recover alot of material (though not all materials), and this apparently let's them ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 10, 11 9:11 AM
You've missed the purpose of the bill...this is a BYOBag ordinance. Join the ranks of proud village shoppers who are thrilled to get rid of those nasty bags we see littering our village, our beaches and countryside. And when you bring your own bag to Waldbaum's they give you five cents.
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 10, 11 10:53 AM
3 members liked this comment
@Dodger this is not a BYOBag ordinance. This is ban the use of plastic bags or be fined ordinance. If people want to bring their bags there is no need for an ordinance. They can do so on their own. This aims to punish retailers to use plastic bags. Many people REUSE these plastic bags as garbage bags for example. You also exaggerate the extent of the littering of these bags. There is a lot more litter out there than plastic bags. Plastic water bottles being a primary example. Should we not ban ...more
By V.Tomanoku (790), southampton on Dec 13, 11 9:07 AM
Sorry, but you are mistaken. Plastic is not "banned" in this ordinance and it is not banned in the SHV ordinance. In fact, most of the reusable shopping bags consumer use today are made of plastic. The shiny bags you buy in Waldbaum's are heavy duty plastic, which makes them reusable. Most of the woven bags you see with company logos on their sides are made of polyolephen and, like the fabric and carpets in your car, are made of plastic. There is only one kind of plastic bag "banned" and that ...more
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 14, 11 6:37 PM
2 members liked this comment
Aren't there more pressing matters for the Town Board to be addressing? Thoughtful citizens already recycle everything under the sun so plastic/paper
bags are not filling up the landfills. Additionally, you never know what your purchases will amount to. So, first, one has to buy bags and then use guess work when heading out the door to shop, considering how many bags to drag around. Think about the difference between shopping for weekly items and then visualize the number of bags it would ...more
By RJH (5), westhampton on Dec 9, 11 6:08 PM
There are many issues "more pressing" which is why people are asking why this is taking so long to complete. Rye, New York, held two hearings of 1 hours each on the new local law they passed Wednesday night in a 7-0 vote. Again, why spend so much time on a matter that was easy for other towns to implement, required NO POLICING, no fines, just community pride...I repeat...PRIDE. When's the last time the Town Board did anything that generated pride in our town? Bickering, yes. Pride, no. We ...more
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 9, 11 9:49 PM
You forget the progressive couples that rally around making up these false statistics don't have children like the rest of us. They are mostly granola eating mushroom collecting minimalists. Off they go in there Prius each day to the market (Preferably one under 8500 Sq ft) and buy an apple and some millet, maybe a box of green tea and some tofu.
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Dec 10, 11 1:21 AM
2 members liked this comment
Then they return to there salt box in the woods and paint the dust in the sun light while listening to N.P.R. on there transistor radio, So you see, it is not an inconvenience for them at all to bring a small box or stocking out with them as they skulk out the fetch provisions for their partner, cat and themselves.
By 27dan (2854), Southampton on Dec 10, 11 1:21 AM
Translation:

Yeah, gee, those who believe in taking only what you need to survive in this world really are the problem.

NEXT.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 10, 11 10:35 PM
@ RJH:

I liked the last paragraph.
Dec 10, 11 10:50 PM appended by Mr. Z
Have you heard of Dylan Ratigan? He recently had a SPECTACULAR rant about what he expects from the "commander-in-chief"...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 10, 11 10:50 PM
Einstein...this is being done for your grandchildren's grandchildren.
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 11, 11 6:01 PM
I agree the town has more important things to worry about.
By EastEnd68 (888), Westhampton on Dec 9, 11 7:09 PM
It wil be a good feature on MTV's Ridiculousness!
By kpjc (161), east quogue on Dec 10, 11 8:03 AM
Clearly the Town mandated Green Bag should be the first to be banned. Its silly I have to buy official Town of Southampton Green Garbage bags to put 3 or 4 of my regular white garbage bags in to dispose of them at a Transfer Station.
By ridiculous (214), hampton bays on Dec 10, 11 10:24 AM
4 members liked this comment
I suppose it is ironic - though the green bag is the tax we pay to dispose of our garbage. Have any suggestions for how the Town can fairly charge residents to get rid of their trash?
By Nature (2966), Hampton Bays on Dec 10, 11 10:37 AM
BY weight. Every transfer station already has 2 to 3 staff members , add a scale to each one, weigh the bags of non recycled waste, and charge. Like a scale at the grocery store check out. That would encourage recycling; fees by weight would correspond to the cost of transporting and disposing of the waste. In the 1980's we used to pay the attendants cash, I think a flat fee per visit. That was stopped for a few reasons. I think with technology, people would be paying electronically rather than ...more
By ridiculous (214), hampton bays on Dec 10, 11 9:42 PM
1 member liked this comment
@ridiculous:

Fool.
Dec 10, 11 10:40 PM appended by Mr. Z
P.S. 3, and possibly 4.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 10, 11 10:40 PM
Someone please get the figure on how much transfer station/landfill volume is required for a thousand paper bags vs. a thousand plastic bags. Now multiply that by the thousands of bags used monthly and tell us how much more space we'll need to make available if this Kumbaya packaging experiment is initiated.

Let's not forget that when old landfills are opened fifty year old newspapers are still readable - so much for paper decomposing!
By VOS (1241), WHB on Dec 10, 11 11:24 AM
1 member liked this comment
Not to forget how many trees are lost to produce these or all the chemicals that are used in recycling.
By V.Tomanoku (790), southampton on Dec 13, 11 9:33 AM
Those trees come from tree farms and tree farms are a good thing, because the farmers replant trees. It's a renewable resource. Take away tree farms and the land will become strip malls and McMansion housing developments. Better to have tree farms than more cement, more half-empty malls and more crappily built oversized houses. And, of course, there is the smart alternative to either paper or plastic -- BYOB. I bring my own bags and I have yet to become crippled from the extra effort of lugging ...more
By btdt (449), water mill on Dec 14, 11 11:21 AM
I'm all for tree farms. But the rate of growth of those trees to make paper bags is very long in relation to the rate of consumption of paper bags (without going into the costs associated with the process and the impact of the chemicals used to recycle brown paper bags). There is nothing wrong with you BYOB. Likewise there is nothing wrong with me reusing my plastic bags as garbage can liners. What I find wrong is a few people trying to impose their preferences on the majority. There are alternatives ...more
By Toma Noku (616), uptown on Dec 15, 11 4:03 PM
With this legislation, 1000 plastic bags will be elimated and 200 paper bags will replace them in the first year alone. BTW...recycling of single use plastic bags is the biggest recycling FAILURE in history. Less than 2% are recycled worldwide. If that wee the success rate for cancer treatment, we would be TERRIFIED.
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 10, 11 12:13 PM
OK, can you say "Great Pacific Garbage Patch"?

The problem here is (we have a S***LOAD), is that paper bags are easy.

Carting your own shopping bags, that's hard...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 10, 11 10:29 PM
The expression on Malone's face is priceless. Could he be thinking about all those reusable bags he would have to carry? Or will he just take paper?
By nellie (451), sag harbor on Dec 10, 11 12:35 PM
I've actually seen a Village board member, who said she would also ban the use of paper bags, shop a t Walbaum's at go for the paper bag and not BYOB...So much for that...
By Toma Noku (616), uptown on Dec 16, 11 9:04 AM
Mr Malone is calculating how many votes these bags are worth.
By EastEnd68 (888), Westhampton on Dec 10, 11 9:21 PM
4 members liked this comment
This comment has been removed because it is a duplicate, off-topic or contains inappropriate content.
By Nature (2966), Hampton Bays on Dec 10, 11 10:40 PM
Separation of Church and State?

Separation of Corporation (money) and State.

They may as well be a religion anyway, bowing at the altar of the Almighty Dollar.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 10, 11 11:06 PM
As opposed to the almighty Euro?...LOL. And they want us to get all European and everythin' and BYOB...LOL
By Toma Noku (616), uptown on Dec 16, 11 9:07 AM
Another late in the evening blast of Socialism, thanks for the predictable response Z.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Dec 11, 11 8:57 AM
1 member liked this comment
bf, there is nothing more predictable than your pathetic cries of socialism. You and a couple of your clueless cronies are the last pathetic bunch of baggers still clinging to a paranoid ideology of fascist capitalism. You dream of being the 1% but know it is out of reach for you, so you act the part instead. For all your false bravado, in the end, you are afraid of a ban on plastic bags? That is the "socialist" threat that keeps you up at night? Step aside so you are not squashed by the revolution ...more
By razza5351 (551), East Hampton on Dec 11, 11 10:21 AM
2 members liked this comment
Some President's throughout history have known when their Congress was purchased, and paid for.

It's a shame you don't...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 11, 11 6:06 PM
Theres a new sheriff in town, Time to clean this mess up and get back to normal!
Dec 12, 11 1:20 AM appended by They call me
Newt 2012 !
By They call me (2826), southampton on Dec 12, 11 1:20 AM
As a progressive independent who looks forward to Obama being a progressive leader in his second term, let me say I could not agree more! GO NEWT! GO! Yeah!
By razza5351 (551), East Hampton on Dec 12, 11 4:24 PM
It's the economy stupid......

As the young move away from Southampton in droves, taxes going through the roof, services (i.e. Leaf pickup) going down. Let's waste time and effort and talk about plastic bags..

Glad they have their priorities straight...
By The Real World (368), southampton on Dec 12, 11 4:16 PM
It's called "fiscal eviction".

Or, "de pecuniae" segregation.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 12, 11 11:16 PM
So, the young are moving to Manorville where the taxes are even higher? Or Nassau, where they are double that of Manorville. You don't know how lucky we have it here on the East End, Mr. Real World (yeah, right).

But it is the economy, stupid. An economy based on the beauty of our ocean, bays and the 99 lakes and streams in Southampton Town. Truth is, the latter is more the domain of locals like you and me. Visitors rarely enjoy them because they don't know where we've hidden them.

Ask ...more
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 12, 11 6:04 PM
2 members liked this comment
I haven't read any other comments, nor have I read a word of the actual article, but I will say my piece on plastic bags while admittedly not reading any of the discussion at hand: the topic of plastic bags has always perturbed me. I absolutley hate plastic bags. I am not a tree hugging hippie, and I am not a fan of government intervention in matters that don't belong in government's hands; however, plastic bags are just so rampantly destructive that something has got to be done about them. Govenment ...more
By getalife (61), Southampton on Dec 13, 11 12:14 AM
1 member liked this comment
Hey Dodger, as you shop in Riverhead this holiday season with the money leftover from paying your taxes, you should consider the following:

Of course, no one wants to specifically hurt the environment. To that arguement I always find it interesting how an environmentalist can stress the importance of hunting and fishing. To save the environment just so you could kill its inhabitants cracks me up.

My point was, town board needs to focus on creating a local economy to support ...more
By The Real World (368), southampton on Dec 13, 11 1:54 PM
I don't hunt but I occasionally fish. Regardless of who does or who doesn't, I respect them if they eat what they catch and fish is a renewable resource. Oil and gas isn't and that's what plastic bags are made from. Paper bags are made from renewable resources, too, and the Village bag code even requires that they're made from recycled paper.

The proposed (excuse me, sabotaged) Town BYOBag program doesn't cost the town anything to implement. And I agree, they should be creating new ...more
By Dodger (161), Southampton Village on Dec 14, 11 6:25 PM
1 member liked this comment
I'm all for the bag ban Razzz, my comment was directed at ZZZZman's typical backhand at capitalism.
By bigfresh (4666), north sea on Dec 13, 11 5:09 PM
1 member liked this comment
You are the best "straight man", any comedian could hope for.

I live, eat, sleep (when I can) recycling. It's a family thing.

If you were in the business, you'd understand how the town agreed years ago to create a comprehensive recycling program, with various carters throughout the Five Towns. Then, they realized what it would cost, and that they couldn't own a McMansion like the Jones' if they paid for it.

They filched on the deal, and the carters followed through every ...more
Dec 14, 11 9:53 PM appended by Mr. Z
AND, the carters did it at their OWN expense.
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 14, 11 9:53 PM
There's no reason not so support this. If you oppose it, you not only hate and want to harm your local community, but also the world at large.
By johnj (1024), Westhampton on Dec 14, 11 9:01 AM
I hate nothing except ridiculous legislation. I want to harm nothing except its chance for passage. The Southampton Village experience has been a mess since their enaction of a plastic bag ban. Now, in addition to added expense at the store there is additional space needed for paper bags at the store, at home, in the garbage, at the transfer stations, and at the landfills for decades to come.

The good news is there are fewer plastic bags littering the community - the bad news is the ...more
By VOS (1241), WHB on Dec 14, 11 1:11 PM
3 members liked this comment
Paper bags don't have to litter the community, if you make a LONG TERM investment, in YOUR OWN SHOPPING BAGS.

Idiot America, in the flesh, ladies and gentlemen...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 14, 11 9:59 PM
The idea is NOTHING has to litter the community! Demanding that every shopper carries their own bag is ridiculous and will do nothing to stop littering. But it will make some very smug in their own Kumbaya way.
By VOS (1241), WHB on Dec 14, 11 11:59 PM
1 member liked this comment
It's funny that the retail industry wants to keep distributing those plastic eyesores that litter the landscape. It will save retailers money when people get used to using their own bags, and both the plastic and paper bags that retailers pay for can be done away with. Why is the retail industry fighting a lifestyle change that will save them money? Sounds pretty self-defeating to me.
By btdt (449), water mill on Dec 14, 11 11:30 AM
1 member liked this comment
... my concern is that if the Town bans these plastic bags then what will the citizenry use to pick up the dog crap?
By William Rodney (561), southampton on Dec 14, 11 5:24 PM
1 member liked this comment
Or.....all the intractable autocratic BS dictated by the Queen ATH and her Rubber Stamp Bridget.
By Tennyson (77), Quogue on Dec 16, 11 7:26 AM
I would prefer the legislation ban ALL bags...this way we'd be forced to bring our own! People do not always change habits willingly..they need a nudge. Like ATH said..."we didn't like wearing seat belts either, but look how many lives it has saved, and it's a habit now." I cannot even conceive of starting my car without my belt on. Banning plastic bags is a start. I get a 25 cent credit every time I check out. I BYOB and earn 5 cents for each bag I bring and pack. And I don't get annoyed ...more
By RegisterdIndependent (6), southampton on Dec 14, 11 6:05 PM
1 member liked this comment
Listen Madam, I still don't, AND NEVER WILL where a seat belt. No one tells me what is good for me! GOT THAT .... GOOD . As far as the plastic bag thing if it has truly been proven to hurt that much marine life then we should ban them. But I want to see true evidence not some ALGORE BS to sell a book. Not some global warming statistics made up to control and regulate us through Cap and Trade.
By joe hampton (3461), south hampton on Dec 14, 11 10:20 PM
Off topic, but just some "food for thought".

250 million years ago, the oceans were anoxic, 90% of the life on the planet went extinct, and the Arctic was the equivalent of the Sargasso Sea. There are core samples to prove it. The planet was a brick oven, and the excess carbon ended up becoming oil.

We have now burned a significant quantity of that sequestered carbon, put it back into the atmosphere, and strangely enough the planet is getting warmer.

Things that make ...more
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 15, 11 10:07 PM
Maybe you should "where" a thinking cap instead. Personally, I am glad you don't "where" a seat belt.
By fcmcmann (417), Hampton Bays on Dec 15, 11 10:41 PM
1 member liked this comment
Gee, Joe Hampton, what a superhero you are! No seatbelts! Wow, impressive. What will you do for your next bit of "no one tells me what to do" challenge - refuse to put up the flag on your mailbox?
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Dec 16, 11 8:12 AM
I refuse to shop at Waldbaum's parlty because of the bag ban
By patrickstar (67), hampton bays on Dec 15, 11 4:34 PM
I don't think we need a high priced "study" or "educational" campaign to show us how this works. We aren't that stupid, are we?

How many shop at BJ's or Costco? No bags there, and we get along just fine. It is really not hard to collect lightweight bags and keep them in the car, and it's really nice not to have a heap of trash in your kitchen when you finish unpacking the groceries.

Just cut to the chase, ban the bags, and get on with other more important things.


By M. O'Connor (147), Southampton on Dec 17, 11 9:12 AM
What it boils down to is that people just don't like to be told what to do.
By M. O'Connor (147), Southampton on Dec 17, 11 9:14 AM
And too stupid to know that what they're doing is wrong.
By johnj (1024), Westhampton on Dec 19, 11 1:31 PM
How about uneducated... not "stupid"...

Think it's a bit less rude that way.
By Allergic2Stupidity (77), Riverhead on Dec 20, 11 10:41 AM
1 member liked this comment
Funny screen name you picked for someone who's sensitive to the use of the word "stupid."
By fidelis (199), westhampton beach on Dec 24, 11 3:11 PM
1 member liked this comment
I walk the beach every day with my dog with several other dog owners and we ALL pick up after our dogs with biodegradable bags sold everwhere. We do use the KK etc bags. Today we picked up about 15 pounds of garbage (bottles, cans, etc) and do so every day. There are many dog owners who DO NOT pick up after their dogs several with very large dogs and many times we pick their "leftovers" up using our bags.
By xtiego (698), bridgehampton on Dec 17, 11 7:18 PM
What happened to save the trees, use a plastic bag instead???
By wmmw (6), East Hampton on Dec 18, 11 1:37 PM
we left the 1970's
By peoplefirst (787), Southampton on Dec 18, 11 2:14 PM
How about save the planet and save yourself!? Is this an issue to some because the plastics industry is the third largest manufacturing industry in America? Plastic bags are made from petrochemicals. More specifically, we use ethylene, which is the most produced organic compound on Earth, and is derived from natural gas and petroleum. These organic compounds are non-renewable resources! We have a LIMITED supply of petrochemicals and one would think that humanity would choose to use these dwindling ...more
By dklughers (46), east Hampton on Dec 21, 11 12:27 AM
2 members liked this comment
Plastics industry... petrochemicals... ethylene... hydrofracking... oil shale extraction and offshore drilling... save the trees... You lost your audience within the first ten words. Stop preaching and get a point. These types of sermons do more harm to the environment than Republicans do. And, yes, I carry my own bags already, thank you.
By bailey (52), East Hampton on Dec 21, 11 3:59 PM
Or, is it more likely that the audience has an attention span problem?

How about all those alkaline batteries in the trash? Might be a significant part of how all that mercury got into the fish, eh?

No plastic bags, one less use for "Big Oil" in the long run, and a step toward sustainability. You can make complex hydrocarbon chains from things other than oil...
By Mr. Z (11847), North Sea on Dec 21, 11 7:37 PM
Well, if people want to ban the use of plastic bags.. get ready for the 1,2,3 punch coming up next. Someone will invariably find a way to prove the point that all plastics are harmful and should be banned. The keyboards you type on, the material your coffee maker is made of, the casing on your smartphones, and on to ad nauseam..

But, will people support that ban? I'm thinking not so much.
By Allergic2Stupidity (77), Riverhead on Dec 21, 11 6:39 PM
This vote is a travesty, an outrage on the same scale (and brought off by the same Gang of Three) as the vote last year to annoint Russell Kratoville, a refugee from the sinking ship of OTB, a loyal Republican stalwart from Riverhead, to be the chief of a wholly unnecessary Business Management Department, at $150,000 a year.

Just as in that instance, the choice for good governance was plain. Just as in that instance, the voice of the people was loud and clear in favor of the right choice. ...more
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Dec 23, 11 2:21 PM
If you are so sure the "overwhelming majority" of the people want to see this ban enacted why then must a "flat-out ban" be necessary?

Reusable bags are in every grocery store, some have paper bags available, yet the overwhelming majority want their purchases in plastic bags. That, in and of itself, is no problem; if the plastic bags become a problem down the road, deal appropriately with the cause of the problem, not the device.

And, to the writer above who claims 10% of all ...more
By VOS (1241), WHB on Dec 24, 11 12:36 AM
Probably should have made it clearer. I meant the overwhelming majority of those who expressed an opinion to the Town Board, by writing or speaking, were against the Kratoville appointment and for the plastic bag ban. A flat-out ban, rather than some lame "education program," is necessary because most people won't readily give up the convenience of plastic bags, even those who know it's the right thing. (I include myself in the latter category.)

As for the claim that 10% of all plastic ...more
By Turkey Bridge (1979), Quiogue on Dec 24, 11 2:39 PM