Saunders, Real Estate, Hamptons

427 Comments by localEH

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Tensions Soar at East Hampton Airport Noise Meeting on Wednesday

Last night was nothing short of a modern day lynching of all pilots of little prop Cessnas to jets. The crowd vindictively called pilots a myriad of nasty names and raucously applauded those who advocated full closure of the airport. Only anti-airport proponents were allowed to speak - pilots were not given a chance to address the Board. Ironically, as a local pilot I agree that some restrictions can be made on helicopter traffic to reduce their noise impact on the area, and would be willing to work with the anti-airport folks to find middle ground to alleviate their concerns. But they made it loudly clear that they had absolutely ZERO interest in working to find a joint solution and their only goal was to close the airport. In fact one if the anti-airport leaders admitted he was a land management/developer and wanted the airport closed so he could redevelop it into and industrial park! So at least now they have removed their mask of civility and admitted their true goal of closing the airport and making a profit to line their own pockets. So much for their "working together" with the pilots." Aug 28, 14 2:09 PM

You are the one who is trying to deny facts which are in a recorded session. We were called amoral, liars, greedy, corrupt, and dangerous cowboys who made it their goal to terrify little children. One woman, perhaps you, even gleefully talked about shooting us out of the sky with a gun. I did sign up to speak but was advised by a board representative to reconsider because of the hostile atmosphere. You would not have heard me. You would have attacked me like a pack if rabid wolves. Us local pilots were willing to work with you, but you made it very clear you have no interest in working with anyone. " Aug 28, 14 11:24 PM

You can drop the pretense about not wanting to close the airport. Your QSC group and the airport opponents expressly made your goal clear at the meeting:
It is time for you (pilots) to leave - P. Currie (QSC)
Ban all aircraft, not just helicopters - S. Levine (QSC/architect)
Only way to stop the torture is to close the airport - F. Dalene (QSC/land developer and builder)
Close the airport and convert it into an industrial complex - P. Wolf (land developer)
Close the airport - T. MacNiven (real estate agent)
There were dozens of others who said the same thing. Closure is your goal since, as a real estate agent yourself, you all clearly stand to personally profit from the closure of the airport and it's redevelopment into residential and commercial properties." Aug 29, 14 1:51 PM

East Hampton Village Board Adds To Pressure On Town To Resolve Airport Noise Problems

Your ignorance about aviation is showing. The vertical visibility/ceiling on Sat stayed between 100ft (airport closed) to 600ft (all traffic has to come in under it to visually see the airport to land). Despite some who would like everyone to believe HTO is a major airport, it doesn't have any ILS systems. They were not low because they wanted to annoy you (surprise, the world does not revolve around you). They were low because they were required to be low for safety and to comply with FAA regs - something which will not ever change even without the grant money." Sep 9, 14 3:49 PM

Happy to explain. Please read FAR Part 91.119 (you can Google it). Per the FAA a fixed wing plane can fly over the beach and ocean at a minimum altitude of 500ft. A helicopter can fly below that minimum altitude so long as it is not a danger (which it is not over the ocean). Now you know that nothing any of those pilots was doing was illegal or in violation of any FAA regulation. " Sep 9, 14 5:41 PM

Yes there was a whopping 235 people out of more than 100,000 local residents in the east end. That's a minority, an incredibly loud minority but still a minority. How many people use the airport year round, how much money is brought into our local community from those who use the airport, how many local businesses exist because of that income, how many local families are supported by that income. I guarantee you it is exponentially more than 235. The leaders of this minority have openly admitted they want the land to develop it into an industrial complex to make themselves an enormous personal profit at the expense of the whole community. But the good of the community means nothing to people who think the world needs to revolve around them. " Sep 10, 14 12:01 AM

TpS please re-d my responsense and the FAR I cited. It clearls says per the FAA there is no minimum altitude for helicopter. Fixed wing aircraftt have minimums. Helicopters do not (other than the general ones stated in the FAR). So helicopters can legally elect to fly at whatever altitude they deem to be safe unlless they are imeedaatey adjacent to the airport, when theeywill fly at whatever altitue is required by the tower. Most pilots will typically not choose to fly low if conditions permit. We have a saying: Airspspd is life, altitude is life insurance. Why y do they fly at dferent t altudes over the beach - typically so they don't crash hntntoaeach other (it'sacaed s paration). You may call the FAA regs blather but those are the rules. Sadly too many py people out e think the rules shouldn't apply to them and they deserve special treatrent. " Sep 10, 14 12:29 AM

East Hampton Town Board Promises To Quiet Airport

Sounds like the Board has long since already made its decision to reject FAA funding. They will then continue to defund it and refuse to perform any kind of maintenance or repair at it. In two years they will have the airport closed and sold to the anti-airport real estate developers. The negative economic effect on our community will be enormous. All because the Board has aligned with a small group of people who look to personally profit from it. They need to stop pretending this is about noise or aircraft traffic. I flew for over an hour yesterday around HTO and other than one Piper that was landing when I took off, take a guess at how many other aircraft were over the skies of East Hampton - ZERO. No one was up there other than me for over an hour. So much for those hordes of planes and helicopters they would like you to believe are bombarding the area all day, all night, all the time." Sep 24, 14 6:13 PM

East Hampont Town Hires Second Noise Analysis Consultant, Noise Abatement Solutions Ahead

Time slots are the most ridiculous thing ever conceived of. Clearly no actual pilots were allowed to be a part of or participate in this "sub-committee". First, time slots mean lots of airplanes circling the airport for hours on end waiting for a slot to open. How does a massive increase in circling airplanes and hovering helicopters reduce noice?! Not only does it increase noise, it increases the chance of a midair incident as everyone is forced into waiting in the same airspace above the airport. The Town has ZERO control over the airspace and cannot restrict any aircraft in any way - let me repeat, the Town cannot control the number, altitude or location of aircraft flying in the airspace above East Hampton. So how exactly is a slot system restoring your"quiet use and enjoyment". And how do they propose to enforce a slot system in the 9 months there is no tower? This is what happens when you put people who have absolutely no idea what they are talking about in charge while shutting out and silencing those who do. " Nov 14, 14 2:14 PM

The community revenue the airport brings in is well documented and in the millions. And this is not revenue to 1%ers, but locals who benefit from it. But more importantly there is a large community of local pilots who use the airport. We are nowhere near being 1%ers! But we love to fly. It is our passion. It is what gives us joy in life. Why not stop by one day and go for a flight with us. You will see its value is as great as the bike lanes are of value to the cyclists, or the docks are to the fishermen, or the golf courses are to the golfers. Why are you entitled to keep the things you are passionate about but get to destroy the thing I am passionate about? What makes your rights greater than mine?" Nov 14, 14 2:28 PM

That's silly - pilots would not threaten to circle overhead out of animosity. Where am I supposed to go when my hanger and my car are at HTO? Say I fly to Block Island for lunch and come back to find all the "slots" have been used and I have to wait for a slot to open. I have no choice but to circle until one does or I run out of fuel and have to declare an emergency and land anyway. That's why slots are a dangerous and ineffective idea. And no, the town still has ZERO control over planes in the air. Even if the airport was closed planes will still fly all over the area at anywhere from 500ft up - airport or no airport. You would be surprised at how many planes you people are complaining about that never actually land at HTO. Town can't do a thing about those. " Nov 15, 14 10:09 AM

Aviation Community Unhappy With East Hampton Airport Noise Report, Says Money Was Not Well Spent

Your comments continue to sound like desperate and paranoid conspiracy ramblings in an effort to frighten people. No one is turning off their transponders just to hide from you and your hubris. That is so absurd it's comical. If we turn off our transponders we are putting our lives at risk because we no longer show up on TIS and TCAS so other planes can't see and avoid us - no one is foolish enough to do that! No one is performing acrobatics either since you have to have a special type of structurally reinforced plane to do acrobatics. The regular planes you see would have structural failure if they did acrobatics. Plus acrobatics have to be done at much higher altitudes that you would ever notice (ie: 5k and above). That fact that you anti-airport malcontents are resorting to such blatant falsehoods shows just how manipulative you are. " Nov 15, 14 10:12 AM

Second Phase Of East Hampton Airport Noise Analysis Aired, Time Restrictions Recommended

That's because the town's own consultants shot down their absurd proposal to require every aircraft to buy a landing slot via auction as being unfeasible and unreasonable. Also the town's attorneys, who are much more experienced, have spent a lot more time with this issue, and were not paid by Lipper and Wolf to say what they wanted them to say, specifically disagreed about banning all commercial aircraft. By the way 500 signatures is embarrassingly low. Even the people opposed to extending deer hunting season got 1000. " Dec 3, 14 10:17 AM

How do you know it is true? You're just rampantly speculating. You have no data to support your position. That's only your biased and unsupported wish that it was true. I can just as easily claim home property values have gone up because the airport provides accessibility and that extreme restrictions on the airport will cause property values to plummet." Dec 3, 14 10:23 AM

For the right price a legal opinion paper can be bought that confirms the moon is made of blue cheese. Why are a couple of billionaire real estate investors so hell bent on getting their way? I wonder if the airport land being valued at over $1 billion (pre-development) has anything to do with it..." Dec 4, 14 12:45 AM

Just remember that if those bans are put in place they will be universally enforced - there will be NO exceptions. So when Hillary Clinton is supposed to show up at a fund raiser she's gonna have to take the Jitney, when Guild Hall has a problem with the film it is showing to a bunch of celebrity kids the backup film is going to have to be driven out from NYC, when Oscar winner/famous director/renowned author/popular artist XYZ wants to come to East Hampton they are gonna have to sit in 5 hours of dead stop traffic... No exceptions. None." Dec 4, 14 12:56 AM

Military Jet Taking Off At Gabreski Airport Monday Morning Creates Loud Rumble

We call that the sound of freedom. If you think a couple of F18s are loud you should hear an entire F22 fighter wing take off! Or a B2!" Jan 12, 15 1:46 PM

East Hampton Airport Noise Subcommittee Recommends Curfews, Complete Ban On Noisiest Helicopters

Actually the real statistics clearly showed that the vast majority of complaints came from only about 30 people, not thousands, including one who called the hotline more than 2800 times last year alone (that's 8 times a day every day). I'm pretty sure you are one of those 30 people. I'm also pretty sure you make your living doing something related to real estate and property investment/development, just like the rest of your group who can't stop drooling over the 660 acres of land you want to develop. Your community altruism is hard to see beneath the dollar signs flashing in your eyes." Jan 22, 15 3:43 PM

There needs to be an actual dialogue - meaning input from both sides. So far that Town has abjectly refused to allow anyone from the aviation community (I mean local pilots, not commercial ventures) to participate in the discussion. It has been nothing but a monologue by the anti-airport groups. The helicopter restrictions are not unreasonable. However the prohibition against flight training in little C152 and C172 single prop planes, which the noise analysis confirmed is not disturbing anyone, is directly designed to kill all local future aviation interest rather than curb any noise issue. People should question why such a prohibition was included." Jan 22, 15 3:51 PM

UPDATE: Travel Restrictions Lifted But Residents Asked To Stay Off Roadways As Recovery Continues

Me too! Plus they say 8-10 more inches before its done!" Jan 27, 15 9:50 AM

Aviation Businesses File Suit Against FAA, Argue Mismanagement Of East Hampton Airport

It is unbelievable how obtuse you anti-airport people are. The lawsuit against the town is because they have refused to perform the most basic safety maintenance at the airport which is putting people in danger. I can tell you first hand how dangerous the problems are yet the town won't fix them because the anti-airport people won't let them. It is disgusting how people like you are waiting for a terrible accident to take place so you can use it to demand the full closure of the airport. Why on earth would you not want to have a safe airport? Is your hypersensitivity to an 8 second buzz of sound so much more important than the loss of human lives?" Jan 30, 15 11:39 AM

East Hampton Town Proposes Curfews To Curb Airport Noise, Aviators See Airport's Eventual Demise

Stop claiming no one wants to close the airport when that is a bald faced lie. Half of the members of the town's own subcommittee have publicly stated in print and on video that they want to close the airport, with several others already making proposals of what they want to do with the land when it is closed. " Feb 5, 15 3:02 PM

Oh how awful that you have to hear the brief 8 second buzz of an airplane for a whopping total of 160 seconds a day. That's almost 3 mins of noise you must endure per day! Can you imagine the horror if you heard 3 mins of noise from cars, motorcycles, dump trucks, fire trucks, leaf blowers, barking dogs, and neighbors per day...oh wait... " Feb 6, 15 5:22 PM

You would be surprised at how many of us local pilots would be equally happy seeing Blade and large loud helicopters being forced to go elsewhere. If we could just get the town board to understand there is middle ground and that banning all commercial flights (seaplanes) is a death sentence for the airport as a whole. But as we know, that may be the ultimate end game for them." Feb 9, 15 3:01 PM

Looks like Cituzens Against Citizens For Quiet Skies are the only ones with common sense out there in Longmont, Colorado. Your Quiet Skies group appears to be even nuttier than ours. " Feb 10, 15 3:21 PM

East Hampton Airport Budget Committee Cannot Work Out Impact Of Proposed Regulations

The people who are trying to save the airport are LOCALS! It's people who use the airport recreationally year round and whose jobs and local businesses depend on it. It's amazing the extremes you anti airport people will go to just to get your hands on the airport land to develop for your own personal profit. You keep blowing smoke to make its seem like it's about outsiders but that's not the truth." Mar 4, 15 10:07 AM

You have to look at the big picture. The goal of the regs is to financially damage the airport to the point where it can no longer be self sufficient or maintained and will be required to be closed with in 2-3 years. The people who have proposed the regs are all in the real estate industry (development/investment/sale) and want the airport land which is worth over $1 Billion. They have publicly admitted many times they want to develop the land for their personal profit. This is not about noise - it's about money and greed. So yes, it affects us local recreational pilots because we want to protect our local airport from greedy millionaire and billionaire real estate interests. Fact: 20% of all noise complaints came from 2 people, and nearly 50% came from 20 people - all of whom are on either the town's subcommittee or are members of the vocal anti-airport groups. Fact: Only 600 people on the entire East End (Riverhead to Orient/Montauk) have made a noise complaint and most of those only made a single complaint during 12 months, despite months of campaigning by the anti-airport groups encouraging people to call every time they heard any aircraft at all. " Mar 4, 15 10:28 AM

After Traveling From East Hampton To North Sea, Most Likely By Car, Lost Cat Reunited With Family

How exactly is it illegal for a cat to roam on its owners property? Cars don't roam far and it likely got in a work truck or other vehicle while it was parked on the owners property. Put down the gavel, Mr. Judgmental. " Mar 5, 15 2:39 PM

Regulations Will Change East Hampton Airport, But Actual Impact Is Still Being Measured

What color is the sky in your world? The BFAC works for and reports to the town board only, not any committee. Plus no one on the committee is associated with the airport - it is entirely made up of the Quiet Skies leadership and the main land developer interests. Claiming that pilots and airport supporters have any influence over the BFAC is comical (and a little paranoid). More likely all the data clearly shows that the restrictions would have a major negative impact on the airport, if not kill it outright, as many have been warning for weeks. But the town board wants to keep a plausible deniability excuse when it enacts the restrictions in two weeks and claim they had no idea the restrictions would cause the airport to be closed due to lack of funding. Your desperate spin doctoring is starting to reek. " Mar 5, 15 2:56 PM

Group Opposed To East Hampton Airport Restrictions Distributes Fliers Ahead of Hearing

Actually HTO has become the national poster child for how to manipulate data. You intentionally hyper inflated the complaint numbers to create a false "problem". More than 20% of those complaints came from 2 people and 50% came from the same 20 people. One guy even set up an auto dialer! The only special interests here are you wealthy real estate folks who want the airport land so bad you will lie, manipulate, and threaten everyone until you get it. Sorry, us locals are fighting back. " Mar 10, 15 4:30 PM

East Hampton Airport Opponents' Lawsuit Dismissed By Appellate Court

If you mean Ocean Reef Airport, that's a PRIVATE airport. You cannot even land unless you are a member or registered guest with advance registration. As a private airport they can restrict it any way they want. HTO never has been and never could be a private airport. Orange City Municipal (ORC) is a tiny little airport in Iowa that doesn't have any restrictions whatsoever because it's in the middle of nowhere. The cars, trucks, buses, and trains on the east end cause significantly more pollution than all of the aircraft at HTO. And you have an exponentially greater chance of being hit by lightning or eaten by a shark then being injured due to aircraft operations at or near HTO. " Mar 12, 15 12:01 AM

So much for your earlier hollow claims of wanting to find a compromise. It's all about winning at any cost to you - regardless of the damage you will cause this community, local residents, and local businesses. No, you will not "win". You will continue to cause division in the community. You will continue to lie, manipulate, threaten, and bully everyone to get your way and financially line your own pockets. You will cost the town and this community millions of dollars in unnecessary and spurious litigation to pursue a course of action you have been repeatedly cautioned is in violation of the FAA rules and you will lose, just like in the above article. Our airport has been here since 1936 and has had commercial and commuter operations since the 1940s. You will not take our airport from us. " Mar 12, 15 12:22 AM

Community Largely Split on East Hampton Town's Proposed Airport Regulations

Close. The vast majority supports an economically viable airport that services our community, local residents, local businesses, and encourages summer visitors who bring in so much income to the area. The vast majority supports reasonable restrictions on heavy aircraft and helicopters (ex: Sikorsky S92) to certain times of the day. Unfortunately, the people driving the restrictions train are hell bent on defunding and closing the airport, so achieving a mutually reasonable result is impossible." Mar 13, 15 4:09 PM

That's why the economic impact statement is not available - they know it is not viable. The town's best proposal for making up the revenue was to increase landing fees by 75% (imagine if the ferry tried to increase its fee by 75%), tear down the brand new tower (the one that the same people demanded be installed 3 years ago and cost the town >$1M), charge for parking (despite the fact that the parking system would cost as much as it earned in revenue), and hope businesses suddenly want to rent commercial property at the airport." Mar 13, 15 4:19 PM

Southampton Bracing For Increased Helicopter Traffic If New East Hampton Rules Are Adopted

Ironically the leader of the anti-airport movement and professional committee member, Kathleen Cunningham, previously went after the LIRR but couldn't get anyone to join her campaign. So she switched to the airport as her complaint du jour. " Mar 14, 15 6:37 PM

UPDATE: Small Aircraft Makes Hard Landing At East Hampton Airport, Runway Reopened

So glad to hear everyone was safe and unhurt! There was a strong gusty NW crosswind today making landing on Rwy 10-28 difficult and ripe for unexpected excessive side load on a landing gear. Too bad Rwy 16-34 is in such disrepair it couldn't be used. If the town board would have simply performed the repairs they have been promising since 2010 (and local pilots have been begging for), this accident may have been avoided. Fortunately just the plane was injured. This time." Mar 19, 15 12:07 AM

Friends of East Hampton Airport Ask For FAA Intervention For Safety And Access

You are finally admitting you call the hotline every time you hear the slightest sound from any aircraft of any kind - regardless of whether it is actually noisy or objectively disturbing. You call repeatedly to rack up the hotline statistics without any basis, other than to manipulate the system. You don't care if the aircraft is merely flying past HTO without landing, or perhaps is a military/coast guard aircraft on a training mission, or is a life flight aircraft providing urgent medical help - all that matters is your racking up those complaint numbers. " Apr 14, 15 10:15 PM

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